Bas rutten talks movies, tv, chael sonnen, and alistair overeem

[Batzz Spencer]

paullazenby.com :: home (http://www.paullazenby.com/)

Ich sehe Reem jetzt mit ganz anderen Augen.

[bouncer]

Ich auch!:(

[.-r4ki``]

Interessant. Bin gespannt, wie sich das ganze auf Reems Psyche auswirkt in der Vorbereitung auf seinen Fight.

[Black Adder]

Mich wundert dass das jetzt erst hier ankommt.

[iYork]

wasn drecksack und dann soll brock der unsympath sein? der noch seine wrestlingcoaches aus highschool/college zeit hat...

[Droom]

ich glaube zwar trotzdem das der reem gewinnt, aber nach El Guappos Aussage hoffe ich das Lesnar ihn doch auf dem Boden weich klopft :mad:

[xkiddox]

bas muss dringend in die politik wenn er mit tv fertig ist ;-)

[axon]

Then when the management starts to put great fights together for them, directing their careers and the fighter gets better and better, some of them simply can't handle it, and it gets to their head.

I had a bad feeling already when he called himself, after he won the K-1 Grand Prix, a "legend". He actually said in an interview right after he won: "I am a legend now". I don't think a fighter can ever make that comment about himself.

And talking about the Grand Prix, let's face it, he had a great deal of luck as well there. He fought Peter Aerts who had a WAR with Semmy Schilt [previously that night] and was completely banged up, and then he fought [Gokhan] Saki, who had a broken arm AND hand, in the finals! At that moment when you win, you should say: "I'm very happy with the result, the stars were in line for me tonight, I also got a little bit of luck". Because everybody is going to say that about you anyway, you might as well simply say it yourself to keep the people respecting you, but NOT: "I'm a legend".

Joa, was habe ich die ganze Zeit gesagt seinen K1-Titel betreffend? Meine, dass würde ja an sich selbst ein Blinder sehen, aber manche wollen einfach nichts an ihr Traumidol kommen lassen, wie ich in diversen threads gemerkt habe. :D

Und zu seiner Person: Naja, also menschlich habe ich noch nie zu viel von ihm gehalten. Denke dennoch, dass er das Ding gegen Brock macht, dann allerdings von JDS in seine Schranken gewiesen wird. ;)

Edit: Nur die Chronologie der Kämpfe war wohl nicht ganz korrekt (Aerts->Saki).

[Batzz Spencer]

Edit: Nur die Chronologie der Kämpfe war wohl nicht ganz korrekt (Aerts->Saki).

Der Kampf gegen Saki hat sich aber mehr wie ein Finale angefühlt. Da kann es schon passieren, wenn dabei einem das Gedächtnis ein Streich spielt. ;)

[Muzio]

aww i like overeem and this makes it hard to keep up the nut hugging.

+1

[Karastrike]

Naja Overeem hat in einem Interview gesagt das er sich von Golden Glory getrennt hat weil ihm das Management bewusst Sachen verheimlicht hat die zu seinem Nachteil waren. Jetzt wo er in der UFC ist und sich zu 100% auf seine MMA Karriere orientiert ist er wohl auch bei Xtrem Couture meiner Meinung nach besser aufgehoben als bei Golden Glory. Am Ende des Tages ist immer noch er derjenige der vor Millionen von Menschen in einem Käfig seine Gesundheit riskiert und wird wohl auch selber entscheiden können wer seine Finanzen verwaltet.

[iYork]

Naja Overeem hat in einem Interview gesagt das er sich von Golden Glory getrennt hat weil ihm das Management bewusst Sachen verheimlicht hat die zu seinem Nachteil waren. Jetzt wo er in der UFC ist und sich zu 100% auf seine MMA Karriere orientiert ist er wohl auch bei Xtrem Couture meiner Meinung nach besser aufgehoben als bei Golden Glory. Am Ende des Tages ist immer noch er derjenige der vor Millionen von Menschen in einem Käfig seine Gesundheit riskiert und wird wohl auch selber entscheiden können wer seine Finanzen verwaltet.

lies dir mal das interview nochma durch...
hinsichtlich "besser aufgehoben", kann schon sein, dennoch kein grund mit seinen leuten (trainierstab etc.) so umzuspringen. unzwar wegen des geldes. zumal er eben wegen des geldes gewechselt ist und nicht weil golden glory ihm in trainingshinsicht nicht mehr ausreichte.

[Black Adder]

Ausserdem ist Alistair nicht echt als zahlungsfreudig bekannt.

[Karastrike]

lies dir mal das interview nochma durch...
hinsichtlich "besser aufgehoben", kann schon sein, dennoch kein grund mit seinen leuten (trainierstab etc.) so umzuspringen. unzwar wegen des geldes. zumal er eben wegen des geldes gewechselt ist und nicht weil golden glory ihm in trainingshinsicht nicht mehr ausreichte.

Er selber sagt er hat sich nur von dem unseriösen Management von GG getrennt und hätte seine Trainer gerne behalten, was aber nicht möglich war da sie ausschließlich für GG arbeiten. Vielleicht sollte man die Geschichte erst von mehreren Seiten betrachten bevor man ihn als Unmensch abstempelt und auf den 'hate-train' aufspringt.

[Black Adder]

Er selber sagt er hat sich nur von dem unseriösen Management von GG getrennt und hätte seine Trainer gerne behalten, was aber nicht möglich war da sie ausschließlich für GG arbeiten. Vielleicht sollte man die Geschichte erst von mehreren Seiten betrachten bevor man ihn als Unmensch abstempelt und auf den 'hate-train' aufspringt.
Die geschichte läuft jetzt schon ne weile. Und Cor Hemmers hat sich vorige woche dazu geäussert. Und er sagt dasselbe wie Bas.

[Wulfcastle]

Sehe nicht wirklich das Problem. Alistair kann mit wem auch immer er will arbeiten. Es stand Golden Glory schließlich auch frei ihn aus dem Vetrag zu entlassen als er mehrfach verloren hat.

Wenn sich die Machtpostionen verändern ist es nur natürlich neu zu verhandeln oder das Vertragsverhältnis zu beenden.

That's life.

[Jan_]

*schulterheb* Ich will die Leute kämpfen sehen.
Deren Charakter, Finanzen, Privatleben etc. interessiert mich nicht.

[axon]

*schulterheb* Ich will die Leute kämpfen sehen.
Deren Charakter, Finanzen, Privatleben etc. interessiert mich nicht.

So sehe ich das auch. Wen ich jemanden zu einer moralischen Instanz küren möchte, dann bestimmt keinen Kampfsportler... und auch sonst niemand anders... außer mir. :D

[Störr]

Sehe nicht wirklich das Problem. Alistair kann mit wem auch immer er will arbeiten. Es stand Golden Glory schließlich auch frei ihn aus dem Vetrag zu entlassen als er mehrfach verloren hat.

Wenn sich die Machtpostionen verändern ist es nur natürlich neu zu verhandeln oder das Vertragsverhältnis zu beenden.

That's life.

Für was braucht man denn dann überhaupt noch Verträge. Diese Mentalität finde ich nicht gut. Man sieht das auch in den meisten anderen Profi-Sportarten. Vor allem im Fußball sind die Verträge oft nicht mal das Papier wert auf dem sie geschrieben werden. Hängt natürlich auch immer vom jeweiligen Vertrag ab, aber ich finde wenn man einen Vertrag unterzeichnet hat man auch Pflichten und nicht nur Privilegien...

[Karastrike]

Für was braucht man denn dann überhaupt noch Verträge. Diese Mentalität finde ich nicht gut. Man sieht das auch in den meisten anderen Profi-Sportarten. Vor allem im Fußball sind die Verträge oft nicht mal das Papier wert auf dem sie geschrieben werden. Hängt natürlich auch immer vom jeweiligen Vertrag ab, aber ich finde wenn man einen Vertrag unterzeichnet hat man auch Pflichten und nicht nur Privilegien...

Sorry aber das ergibt absolut keinen Sinn.

[Black Adder]

Sorry aber das ergibt absolut keinen Sinn.

Doch.

[Karastrike]

Doch.

Dann erklär es mir bitte.
Sobald man einen Vertrag unterzeichnet hat darf man diesen nicht wieder kündigen wenn man mit der erbrachten Leistung des Managements nicht zufrieden ist? Es reicht nicht nur einen riesen Batzen Geld an das Management zu bezahlen man hat auch noch andere Pflichten? Und die wären?

[angHell]

verstehe es auch nicht so ganz. klar ist das teilw. ne farce, aber auch Ausstiegsmöglichkeiten, Kündigungen usw. sind ja vertraglich geregelt...^^

[Black Adder]

Dann erklär es mir bitte.
Sobald man einen Vertrag unterzeichnet hat darf man diesen nicht wieder kündigen wenn man mit der erbrachten Leistung des Managements nicht zufrieden ist? Es reicht nicht nur einen riesen Batzen Geld an das Management zu bezahlen man hat auch noch andere Pflichten? Und die wären?

Die pflichten sind die, die im vertrag nun einmal vertraglich festgelegt sind. Und die kann man nicht so mir nichts dir nichts ändern wie es dir gerade in den kram passt. Und einen existierenden vertrag kann man auch nicht einfach mal so wieder kündigen wenn dir mal gerade danach ist. Daher kommt es jetzt auch zum prozess. Und Alistair wird beweisen müssen das GG sein vertrauen missbraucht hat so wie er behauptet.
Ich verfolg die geschichte jetzt schon den ganzen tag. Und ich bin seit dem letzten K1 GP nicht mehr so gefesselt gewesen.:D

[Black Adder]

verstehe es auch nicht so ganz. klar ist das teilw. ne farce, aber auch Ausstiegsmöglichkeiten, Kündigungen usw. sind ja vertraglich geregelt...^^

So einfach ist das nicht. Ich weiss zwar nicht was im vertrag steht aber einfach so aussteigen geht nicht. Sonst würde er seinen management vertrag nicht per gericht auflösen lassen wollen.

[angHell]

Jo, schon klar. War auch mehr auf die allgemeine Aussage von Störr bezogen auf die du mit "doch" antwortetest, nicht so sehr auf den kokreten Fall - ich meinte ja nur dass sowas halt geregelt ist, klar sonderkündigungen müssen wohl immer juristisch durchgesetzt werden bei solchen Verträgen...

Aber schön dass Du wieder was zu tun hast! :D

[Black Adder]

Aber schön dass Du wieder was zu tun hast! :D
War schon grausam immer nur UFC. :(
Dieses drama ist fazinierender als das gesamte letzte UFC event.
:D

[angHell]

:rofl:

[Schwerthase]

Yeah, Bas Rutten erzählt was, und schon springt die ganze MMA Gemeinde auf den Hate-Train auf. Der Hammel blökt, die Schafe folgen...

[Karastrike]

The other side of the story about Alistair and GG
I had decided not to respond to all allegations that were made to Alistair's address the last few days by the people of and around GM. My hands itched to respond because most of it is just not true. I travel back and forth since 2004 along with Alistair and GG as a filmmaker. The last 3 years non stop and was with Alistair about the contract negotiations with the UFC and I have talked with him a lot. GG wasn't there and neither was Bas Rutten. I was. I am critical of Alistair, and really do not just take his word for things. People who know me know that. In his version of the story I give him the benefit of the doubt and given the comments from GG, I get that feeling only reinforced.

When the shit storm had died down a bit now I'm just back in the Netherlands late but I thought ... But now I read the response from Bas Rutten, I can not but a few things to try to rectify, because what happened here simply isn't true.

So grab a beer, coffee bag of chips or a copy, because I will try to explain what is really going on.

Let me start at the beginning, Alistair's statement in the last episode of "The Reem".

Since I love Golden Glory fighters and their is always a warm heart, I've worn in the online documentary "The Reem" as much as possible to give attention to them too. Alistair's break with the team where he has been so long had to been treated in the documentary in my eyes, and he agreed to this. We have used the episode to let Alistair tell his side of the story . In it he states that Golden Glory in contract negotiations with the UFC is not playing fair was, and something to his detriment and benefit was included in the contract beyond his knowledge and his reason for the vote of no confidence in the Management of Golden Glory.

A logical response from Golden Glory would have been to that claim to refute, then clear your way through a simple press release your name. As a management accused of disadvantage in making one of their fighters, you want to put that right I think. On the forum would this produce content can go into that claim to refute.
An (official) reaction was unfortunately, instead, a smear campaign that put everyone was able to enjoy the last week. I find it unfortunate that different people and Bas Rutten lend themselves. I will later substantiate.

Nowhere are indeed content to the rationale that Alistair has determined and reinforces my belief that Alistair's side of the story is true and that he made the right choice to go with Golden Glory. I have just returned from America where I got the last two weeks have been for him to shoot a new episode. The level of the UFC is high and professional and in my opinion there is no room for the unprofessional attitude of Golden Glory shows here, especially if you want to perform at the highest level and now the UFC try to follow the mainstream in America .

Prior to the interview with Alistair for The Reem, I contacted Martijn and wanted to give him the chance for him to react and to tell Golden Glory that Alistair side of the story would proceed in the upcoming episode. It had just happened and it was too painful for martin to be on camera about it and I completely understand. I still have it reported that Golden Glory as their side of the story to tell that I'm open.

I also heard Martijn side of the story when it comes to the break with the trainers and that corresponded to what Alistair has said in the last episode. There's rebuttal committed when it comes to what Alistair said about that part and I want to emphasize. That they are not financially came out called martin not the main reason the couldn't continue to work together.

From the camp of GG are each cited the story of the maid. This is a fine example manipulation on their part and I will explain why. Alistair has itself in recent years invested heavily in his own team, partly because GG is not picked up much he asked. He then approached even people including myself and paid everyone out of his own pocket. We then started with The Reem, a new site, clothing, twitter, facebook and have contacts with popular blogs and journalists quoted as Ariel Helwani. All this without the help of GG. Alistair has his own sports physiotherapist, dietician and sparring partners met for the MMA section all arranged and paid without the help of GG. He also paid for room and board for the sparring partners he gets from abroad. So there is a whole team working to the success of Alistair Overeem, trainers, sparring partners are absorbing blows, I as a filmmaker even have his cleaning lady at home. Everyone has a piece in the puzzle that is finally Alistair Overeem. Alistair sees it and has tried to explain to his trainers, his housekeeper as unfortunate example. The trainers are of course great piece in the puzzle and that they would thus be paid, but a part like everybody else. This is fully in communication from GG out of context.

Alistair has left coaches in the past and it's true that the trainers have a large share in the development and performance of a fighter, because of that they have always been properly rewarded by the percentage on the year. Although I do not think that the fighter can be seen as propertyr, loyalty is important, as a fighter but if you feel that it can be better somewhere else there has to be the option to change coaches/team.

All efforts made outside the GG management have contributed to the success of Alistair the last few years in my eyes. Sportwise GG Cor Martijn and all fighter naturally have been very important, but business wise was the management several times the weakest link when it came to matters that were outside the contract. It remains difficult for such a large stable of fighters to accompany partly because of the situation of Rona nd the fact that Bas is in Thailand. Communication is often slow and there are still many that it must be picked up by the trainers who are themselves are busy too.

In my view, management is reaping the fruits of the work of many in their negotiations with other parties. I think it is arrogant of them to say that they are responsible for the "Million Contract". This may also be taken with a grain of salt. I was with Alistair when he got the final figures, and his reaction was visibly disappointed. He also heard that it would be a multimillion dollar contract. There was little room to back the negotiations to go so after a night of sleep to have his reaction was also of Alistair's: Fuck it, we're going to destroy everyone and then it will automatically be okay.

That he is now portrayed as a money-grubber is wrong in my eyes and also hypocrit. He nicely signed a contract with all levels of GG. Days after signing, however, he discovered that something was included in the contract which he knew nothing about. This has made him trust in management has terminated. And that is where the conflict.

Alistair % which he gets had been unchanged since he was a young boy and signed with Golden Glory. But now that besides that he also had a team around him that he had collected from his own pocket in addition to the percentages that gave to GG, he found that it was time to about to sit around the table because his managed didn't picked up on many things he asked like explained above so he felt that if he had to arragne and pay for all these things himself like sparring partners they should renegotiate. He had this much earlier reported to management as reported Cor. Not only his wages went up but also those of Golden Glory, which is why he wanted to sit around the table to talk about all additional things he had to pay for himself like sparring partners which and fysiotherapists which he paid out of his own pocket and wanted to talk about them if he some of those things could be paid for from the 30% he paid them because many of those things are the managements responsibility. He has also needed a different guidance as a champion fighter in my opinion. The fact that he was going to train in the states also played a factor, he can not expect two Dutch coaches that also train the rest of the team to spend even half of there time in america so alistair didn't think the % was realistic anymore if he didn't train full time with them especially if he also had to pay the rest of the team and the team in america at the same time. In my eyes you should negotiate these things and I know from personal experience that if you have good arguments you will always be able to make a deal with alistair, at the end of the day group feeling and honesty are most important for alistair

The fact that Alistair was a change in rates is something that played longer and has nothing to do with the break. Which then get quoted by Cor and thus be brought by many as fact is also shameful. The name of Dutch largest and most successful MMA fighter ever in the Netherlands to get here just thrown away and I think Mixfight unworthy. The beauty of the martial arts I think you can run contrary to the bone, but then each hand to give deference and respect. Although you do not agree with each other does not mean you must hit each other below the belt that's what happened here several times. It is unfortunate that rules on the mat are obviously not true for the business within GG.

I also want to look at the piece on TMZ which is also mentioned by Bas Rutten. Alistair has never said "My management are Morons" and was invented by the site itself. TMZ is a gossip site and they thicken like the private stories. They have someone sit in court by the public records and who will have it picked out when Alistair entered into the trial with GG. We were in America as surprised as anyone when it appeared on Mixfight. The comment about Mickey Mouse get cases where management was a joke when you look back the interview, and is not commensurate with the things that GG is bringing out now. Definitely a tough fight team as GG would adorn a thicker skin than as a point of it.

About Bas Rutten I have to say the following, I hold Bas in high esteem and find him a hero. But what struck me at the various times I had him on camera that he is unconditionally on the side of GG. Nothing wrong with that per se but it is never objective, which doesn't make him a credible source, I think. I interviewed him briefly last fight against Werdum and Alistair o have deliberately not used the interviews because he praised Alistair so far that I was a little too exaggerated. He came over very biased which wasn't good for his view of his position as a commentator, I felt that I had to protect him a bit against himself. I'll see if I can post that interview now.

I prefer to stay out of discussions like this and it discouraged me. But Alistair is a good friend and gets killed publicly at this time. Just as there are people who fight for Golden Glory I do that for Alistair. For your friends to get on, I do not care what the consequences are. I'm open to healthy debate on the points that I specify for and we hope that the discussion around this soap in a respectable way to continue.

Greetings!

Eldar Gross
Creator of "The Reem"

Das ganze gehate gegen Overeem ist einfach lächerlich :mad:

[Black Adder]

:D
Er hat auch was entdeckt.

[punktpunktpunkt]

Btw.
Auf Youtube gibt's erste Folgen von Bas Rutten Punk Payback, falls das noch nicht erwähnt wurde. Sieht lustig aus.

[.-r4ki``]

Es gibt immer mehrere Sichten auf so einen Vorfall. Sich da gleich auf eine Seite zu schlagen und mit dem Finger zu zeigen, ist zu einfach. Es gibt nicht nur weiss und schwarz...