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JetLag
23-06-2004, 23:34
anbei mal eine FAQ zum Thema Schwertkampf und Themen wie:


How is modern fencing different from the "real thing"?

If the "real thing" is a duel with sharps, then aside from the
mortal danger and related psychological factors, the primary
technical difference is that the duellist can win with only a
single good touch, whereas the athlete has to hit his opponent as
many as 15 times and so requires more technical and tactical
depth. Many inferior duellists have won their combats through
sheer dumb luck. This is far less likely in the sport. On the
other hand, the sport fencer takes many defensive risks that
would be unthinkable in a duel, since he has up to 15 "lives" to
work with.

Some purists equate "real" fencing with classical fencing,
ie. the prevalent styles of the traditional French and Italian
schools of fencing that predominated before electric fencing was
popularized. By comparison, modern fencing is more mobile and
athletic, while classical fencers were known for their more
sophisticated phrasing and bladework.

Modern sabre fencing is performed with lightweight weapons and
techniques that do not translate well to military sabres and
broadswords. There is a certain amount of cross-over with
lighter turn-of-the-century duelling sabres, however.

Lastly, it just seems apparent to some that sport fencing has
evolved away from its bloody origins. Tactically and
psychologically, it is true that the sport is a vastly different
world from the duel. The sport fencer's life is never in
jeapordy, and with as many as 15 hits needed to secure victory,
there often isn't even much figurative danger. Since the quality
of a hit is immaterial, fencers will naturally prefer an easy
"wounding" hit over a difficult "fatal" one, and so glancing hits
will often win out over strong thrusts. Technically, however,
there have been few modern innovations, and the sport fencer
still possesses all the technical skills necessary to fight a
duel.
(C) 1993-2002 Morgan Burke

Rest, siehe Anlage.

Gruß Jet

Jörg B.
24-06-2004, 06:54
Hi Jet!

Das ist die FAQ der newsgroup rec.sport.fencing (http://groups.google.de/groups?q=rec.sport.fencing&ie=UTF-8&hl=de).

Sie ist recht umfassend und informativ, danke, das Du sie hier postest.

Was aber diesen Satz angeht:

Technically, however, there have been few modern innovations, and the sport fencer still possesses all the technical skills necessary to fight a duel.

muss ich leider sagen, das das so nicht (mehr) stimmt, jedenfalls nicht in der Praxis. In der Theorie ist modernes Fechten tatsächlich noch an ein Duell bzw die Vorbereitung darauf angelehnt, aber wenn ich mir die Art und Weise, wie die Regeln heutzutage ausgelegt werden, das Equipment, das heute benutzt wird, und die daraus resultierende Art,wie heute trainiert wird, anschaue, muss ich leider sagen, ein moderner Fechter wäre bei einer Konfrontation gegen einen alten Duellisten wahrscheinlich sehr schnell totes Fleisch.

Bei Bedarf gerne mehr dazu, aber später, ich ersauf' hier in Arbeit.

JetLag
26-06-2004, 09:35
Hier noch den 2. und 3. Teil: Equipment und References.
Letzteres enthält z.B.:

Fencing Films

The following films involve some amount of swordfighting or
swashbuckling. They are rated on a four-star system, which is a
general critics' opinion of the film as a whole (taken from commercial
movie databases), not an indicator of the quality or quantity of the
film's fencing. Major actors and occasionally the director (denoted by
a '!') are named. Films with 2 stars or less have been omitted, as
have recent films that have not yet been widely released or reviewed.

The Adventures of Don Juan (1949, Errol Flynn, Raymond Burr, ***)
The Adventures of Robin Hood (1938, Errol Flynn, Basil Rathbone, ****)
Against All Flags (1952, Errol Flynn, Anthony Quinn, **1/2)
Barry Lyndon (1975, Ryan O'Neal, Patrick Magee, !Stanley Kubrick, ***1/2)
Black Arrow (1985, Oliver Reed, **1/2)
Black Pirate (1926, Douglas Fairbanks, ***1/2)
Black Swan (1942, Tyrone Power, Anthony Quinn, ***1/2)
Blind Fury (1990, Rutger Hauer, **1/2)
Bob Roberts (1992, Tim Robbins, ***1/2)
Braveheart (1995, Mel Gibson, ***1/2)
By the Sword (1993, F. Murray Abraham, Eric Roberts, **1/2)
Captain Blood (1935, Errol Flynn, Basil Rathbone, ***1/2)
The Challenge (1982, Toshiro Mifune, Scott Glenn, **1/2)
The Charge of the Light Brigade (1936, Errol Flynn, David Niven, ****)
Conan the Barbarian (1982, Arnold Schwarzenegger, James Earl Jones, **1/2)
The Corsican Brothers (1941, Douglas Fairbanks Jr, **1/2)
The Count of Monte Cristo (1934, Robert Donat, ***)
The Count of Monte Cristo (1975, Richard Chamberlain, Tony Curtis,***)
The Court Jester (1956, Danny Kaye, Basil Rathbone, **1/2)
Crossed Swords (1978, Raquel Welch, Charlton Heston, **1/2)
Cutthroat Island (1995, Geena Davis, Matthew Modine, **1/2)
Cyrano de Bergerac (1950, Jose Ferrer, ***1/2)
Cyrano de Bergerac (1990, Gerard Depardieu, ****)
Dangerous Liaisons (1988, John Malkovich, Glenn Close, ***1/2)
Don Juan de Marco (1995, Johnny Depp, Marlon Brando, ***1/2)
The Duellists (1978, Harvey Keitel, Keith Carradine, !Ridley Scott, ***)
El Cid (1961, Charlton Heston, Sophia Loren, ***)
The Empire Strikes Back (1980, Mark Hamill, Harrison Ford, ****)
Excalibur (1981, Nicol Williamson, !John Boorman, ***1/2)
The Fencing Master (1992, !Pedro Olea, ***)
First Knight (1995, Sean Connery, Richard Gere, **1/2)
The Flame and the Arrow (1950, Burt Lancaster, Virginia Mayo, ***)
Flesh and Blood (1985, Rutger Hauer, !Paul Verhoeven, **1/2)
The Four Musketeers (1975, Richard Chamberlain, Michael York, ***)
Frenchman's Creek (1944, Basil Rathbone, Joan Fontaine, ***)
Gladiator (2000, Russel Crowe, !Ridley Scott, ****)
Glory (1989, Matthew Broderick, Denzel Washington, ***1/2)
Hamlet (1948, !Laurence Olivier, ****)
Hamlet (1969, Anthony Hopkins, ***1/2)
Hamlet (1990, Mel Gibson, Glenn Close, !Franco Zeffirelli, ***)
Hamlet (1996, Kenneth Branagh, John Gielgud, Charlton Heston, ****)
Henry V (1944, Laurence Olivier, ****)
Henry V (1989, !Kenneth Branagh, ***1/2)
Highlander (1986, Christopher Lambert, Sean Connery, **1/2)
The Hunted (1995, Christopher Lambert, **1/2)
Ivanhoe (1953, Robert Taylor, Elizabeth Taylor, ***1/2)
Ivanhoe (1982, James Mason, **1/2)
Ladyhawke (1985, Rutger Hauer, Michelle Pfeiffer, **1/2)
Long John Silver (1954, Robert Newton, Kit Taylor, ***)
Macbeth (1948, Orson Welles, Roddy McDowall, ***)
Macbeth (1971, Jon Finch, ***1/2)
The Magic Sword (1962, Basil Rathbone, **1/2)
The Man in Grey (1946, James Mason, Stewart Granger, ***1/2)
The Man in the Iron Mask (1998, Leonardo di Caprio, Jeremy Irons, ***)
The Mark of Zorro (1920, Douglas Fairbanks, ***)
The Mark of Zorro (1940, Basil Rathbone, Tyrone Power, ***1/2)
The Mask of Zorro (1998, Antonio Banderas, Catherine Zeta-Jones, ***)
The Messenger (1999, Milla Jovovich, !Luc Besson, ***)
Morgan the Pirate (1961, Steve Reeves, **1/2)
Othello (1996, Lawrence Fishburne, Kenneth Branaugh, ***1/2)
The Prince and the Pauper (1937, Errol Flynn, Claude Rains, ***)
The Princess Bride (1987, Mandy Patinkin, Cary Elwes, !Rob Reiner, ***)
The Prisoner of Zenda (1937, Douglas Fairbanks Jr, David Niven, ****)
The Prisoner of Zenda (1952, Stewart Granger, James Mason, ***)
The Private Lives of Elizabeth and Essex (1939, Errol Flynn, ***)
Ran (1985, Tatsuya Nakadai, !Akira Kurosawa, ****)
The Return of the Jedi (1983, Harrison Ford, Carrie Fisher, ***1/2)
Robin and Marian (1976, Sean Connery, Audrey Hepburn, ***1/2)
Rob Roy (1995, Liam Neeson, Jessica Lange, ****)
Romeo and Juliet (1935, Basil Rathbone, Leslie Howard, ***1/2)
Romeo and Juliet (1954, Laurence Harvey, ***)
Romeo and Juliet (1968, Michael York, !Franco Zeffirelli, ***1/2)
Royal Flash (1975, Malcolm McDowell, ***)
Sanjuro (1962, Toshiro Mifune, !Akira Kurosawa, ***)
Scaramouche (1952, Stewart Granger, Janet Leigh, ***)
The Scarlet Pimpernel (1935, Leslie Howard, Merle Oberon, ***1/2)
The Sea Hawk (1940, Errol Flynn, Claude Rains, ****)
The Seven Samurai (1954, Toshiro Mifune, !Akira Kurosawa, ****)
The Seventh Voyage of Sinbad (1958, Kerwin Matthews, ***)
Shogun (1980, Toshiro Mifune, Richard Chamberlain, **1/2)
Sinbad the Sailor (1949, Douglas Fairbanks Jr, Maureen O'Hara, ***)
Six-String Samurai (1998, Jeffrey Falcon, Justin McGuire, ***)
The Spanish Main (1945, Maureen O'Hara, Paul Heinreid, ***)
Spartacus (1960, Kirk Douglas, !Stanley Kubrick, ****)
Sunshine (1999, Ralph Fiennes, William Hurt, ****)
Star Wars (1977, Harrison Ford, Alec Guinness, ****)
Sweet Liberty (1986, Alan Alda, Michael Caine, **1/2)
The Sword of Sherwood Forest (1961, Richard Greene, Peter Cushing, **1/2)
The Three Musketeers (1935, Walter Abel, **1/2)
The Three Musketeers (1948, Gene Kelley, Lana Turner, ***)
The Three Musketeers (1974, Michael York, Raquel Welch, ***)
The Three Musketeers (1993, Tim Curry, Charlie Sheen, **1/2)
Throne of Blood (1957, Toshiro Mifune, !Akira Kurosawa, ****)
Tom Jones (1963, Albert Finney, Suzannah York, ****)
Under the Red Robe (1937, Raymond Massey, ***)
The Vikings (1958, Kirk Douglas, Tony Curtis, **1/2)
The Warriors (1955, Errol Flynn, **1/2)
Willow (1988, Val Kilmer, !Ron Howard, ***)
The Yakuza (1975, Robert Mitchum, Takakura Ken, ***)
Yojimbo (1962, Toshiro Mifune, !Akira Kurosawa, ****)
Young Sherlock Holmes (1985, Nicholas Rowe, **1/2)

Gruß Jet

JetLag
26-06-2004, 09:41
Was aber diesen Satz angeht:
muss ich leider sagen, das das so nicht (mehr) stimmt, jedenfalls nicht in der Praxis.
Wär auch zu schön gewesen ;)